Every April 22nd, a billion people across 193 countries do something for the planet. Companies make bold commitments. Partnerships get announced. And then April 23rd arrives.

For businesses building sustainability into how they actually operate (not just how they communicate) that day after is the real test. Because the ROI of Earth Day isn't in the moment. It's in the partnerships that outlast the press release, the operational changes that compound year over year, and the culture that doesn't need a calendar reminder to care.

In this special Earth Day episode of It Shouldn't Be This Hard, co-hosts Phil White and Heidi Schoeneck sit down with Kathleen Rogers, President of EarthDay.org — one of the most recognized environmental platforms on the planet — to ask the question she returns to every single year: What do we do the day after Earth Day?

From the paradox of growing awareness alongside growing powerlessness, to the equity arguments hiding inside the word "environment," to what it actually takes to keep a billion-person movement going — this is a conversation about turning caring into action. Not just on April 22nd. Every day.

Key Takeaways:

• Why awareness and powerlessness are growing at the same time and what that means for anyone trying to drive change
• How redefining "environment" as what surrounds you reframes sustainability as an equity issue, not just an ecological one
• Why the antidote to greenwashing fear isn't a better communications strategy
• How incremental progress beats absolutism when building movements that last
• Why the intention–action gap is as much a strategic problem as a communications one
• What "the day after Earth Day" reveals about the difference between moments and movements

Timestamps:

• 00:00 – Introduction: What do we do the day after Earth Day?
• 01:08 – The paradox of awareness: more knowledge, more powerlessness
• 03:50 – What does the ‘environment’ actually mean? And how a simple definition can change everything
• 05:17 – Climate equity: who bears the real burden of environmental harm
• 05:50 – Why companies are afraid to talk about climate change
• 06:30 – Urban tree planting, community tools, and building the tent for the ‘do-gooders’ of the world
• 07:26 –The billion-person challenge: keeping momentum after April 22nd
• 08:15 – Closing wisdom: nature as miracle, protector, and source of hope

About the Show It Shouldn't Be This Hard is the podcast for leaders, founders, and change-makers reimagining what good business looks like: real conversations, radical ideas, and the belief that purpose and profit can — and must — coexist.

Hosted by Phil White and Heidi Schoeneck, the show explores how sustainability can drive business performance, especially under real commercial pressure. Season 2 continues those conversations at the intersection of purpose and performance — because the work matters every day, not just one day a year.

Additional Resources:

🤖 Meet Gaia, our sustainability AI: https://grounded.world/gaia/

🌍 Get Grounded: https://grounded.world/

#EarthDay #Sustainability #ESG #ClimateAction #ItShouldntBeThisHard #EarthDayEveryDay

After a full season of conversations with leaders from Starbucks, Plastic Bank, Earth Day Organization, Philip Morris International, BIGGBY Coffee, Divert, and The Washington Post one theme kept surfacing:

If so many people care about sustainability… why is doing the right thing in business still so hard?

In this special Season 1 reflection episode of It Shouldn’t Be This Hard, co-hosts Phil White and Heidi Schoeneck step back from the individual interviews to connect the patterns behind ESG, systems change, sustainable supply chains, and purpose-driven leadership.

This is a compilation episode revisiting the most powerful insights from across Season 1 and asking what they reveal about the intention–action gap inside modern business.

From corporate accountability to empathetic capitalism, this conversation explores why progress stalls and what actually makes sustainable transformation possible under real commercial pressure.

Key Takeaways:

• Why sustainability struggles are rarely about intention and almost always about systems design
• How shareholder pressure, risk aversion, and legacy operating models create barriers to ESG progress
• Why extractive business models create long-term instability in global supply chains
• How behavior change scales when sustainability is operationalized
• Why shame and cancel culture can slow corporate transformation and curiosity unlocks collaboration
• How small, visible actions rebuild agency and close the intention–action gap

Featured Voices from Season 1:

• David Katz (Founder & CEO of Plastic Bank) on corporate adaptation and risk
• Jenny Morgan (Author of ‘Cancel Culture in Climate’) on cancel culture and “pretty good” sustainability.
• Karimah Hudda (Founder of illumine.earth) on conformity inside large institutions.
• Bob & Michelle Fish (Co-Founders of One BIGG Island in Space) on direct trade and empathetic capitalism.
• Amelia Landers (Former VP of Innovation, Starbucks) on designing convenience into sustainable behavior.
• Jennifer Motles (Chief Sustainability Officer of Philip Morris International) on driving change inside controversial industries.
• Kathy Baird (Former Chief Communications Officer of The Washington Post) on apathy and civic disengagement.
• Hilary (Former CMO of Divert) on food waste and operational sustainability.

Timestamps:

• 00:00 – Introduction: Why “doing the right thing” still feels hard
• 00:40 – Season 1 patterns and the intention–action gap
• 01:15 – Plastic Bank: Risk, shareholders, and adaptation
• 03:25 – Cancel Culture in Climate: Systems built to punish risk
• 05:10 – Systems change and institutional conformity
• 06:40 – BIGGBY Coffee: Extractive vs empathetic capitalism
• 11:50 – Starbucks: Designing sustainable behavior
• 14:25 – Come into Conversations with Curiosity
• 15:00 – PMI: Courage inside controversial industries
• 16:20 – Overwhelm, apathy, and disengagement
• 17:45 – Divert: Small actions that sustain momentum against climate change
• 19:05 – Closing reflections: It shouldn’t be this hard

Additional Resources:

🤖 Meet Gaia, our sustainability AI: https://grounded.world/gaia/

🌍 Get Grounded: https://grounded.world

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It Shouldn’t Be This Hard is the podcast for leaders, founders, and change-makers reimagining what good business looks like: real conversations, radical ideas, and the belief that purpose and profit can (and must) coexist.

Hosted by Phil and Heidi, the show explores how sustainability can drive business performance especially under real commercial pressure.

Season 1 brought together global brands, social enterprises, and systems thinkers to challenge extractive models and rethink the future of responsible business.

People don’t want to “be sustainable”... and Starbucks learned that the hard way. In this episode of It Shouldn’t Be This Hard, we learn from Amelia Landers, VP of Innovation at Starbucks, for a rare inside look at how one of the world’s most iconic brands is trying to close the intention–action gap for convenient -yet conscious- coffee.

For Starbucks, convenience is everything. Millions of people move through stores every day with deeply ingrained habits, emotional attachments, and morning rituals that are hard to change. Yet these same rituals are where some of the biggest opportunities for sustainable behavior change actually live.

Amelia Landers unpacks what she’s learned designing sustainability inside a global retail ecosystem where speed, consistency, and emotional comfort often outrank environmental intent. From reusable cup systems to packaging innovation, she shares how Starbucks is navigating circularity, consumer psychology, and systems change in real time.

This conversation is honest, practical, human — and required listening for anyone trying to make corporate sustainability work at scale.

Key Takeaways:

• Why “being sustainable” doesn’t motivate customers — but “making their world better” does: Sustainability is a polarizing identity; personal impact is a universal motivator.
• How Starbucks is tackling the convenience vs. sustainability paradox: Behavior change happens when sustainable choices are just as easy, seamless, and convenient as the familiar ones.
• Reusable cups as behavior design — not just waste reduction: A small but passionate group of customers proved that ritual, identity, and emotional connection drive adoption.
• Why circularity requires collaboration, not competition: Infrastructure, regulation, and recycling systems can’t be solved by one brand alone — “there is no IP in sustainability.”
• Progress over perfection in corporate sustainability: Sustainable innovation demands humility, experimentation, and the courage to move without all the answers.
• How Starbucks uses data, customer insights, and waste tracking to measure real impact: Metrics matter — especially when they reinforce behavior change and customer engagement.

Timestamps:

00:00 – Introduction

02:00 – Amelia’s path from brand building at P&G to sustainable innovation at Starbucks

06:00 – Entering sustainability naively and discovering the complexity of systems change

08:04 – The convenience paradox: why “easy” always wins (and what Starbucks is doing about it)

10:30 – Designing reusable cup programs and customer-driven packaging innovation

14:07 – The hard parts: regulation, infrastructure, and the limits of what one company can control

16:01 – EPR legislation and the messy reality of circularity

17:49 – Progress, not perfection: leadership lessons from Starbucks’ sustainability evolution

19:46 – Influence without authority: navigating internal tensions

25:37 – Why tracking matters: measuring waste, behavior change, and customer engagement

28:38 – How different customer groups perceive Starbucks’ sustainability work

29:51 – Amelia’s closing wisdom: “Action is the antidote to despair.”

Additional Resources:

🤖 Meet Gaia, our sustainability AI: https://shorturl.at/zHp81

🌍 Get Grounded: https://shorturl.at/SXFdo

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It Shouldn’t Be This Hard is the podcast for leaders, founders, and change-makers reimagining what good business looks like — real conversations, radical ideas, and the belief that purpose and profit can (and must) coexist.