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In this episode of Horse First, Lockie Phillips sits down with Canadian horse trainer Remy Burley, a specialist in operant conditioning and clicker training.

The conversation begins with identity, representation, and the reality that who we are inevitably shapes how we move through the horse world. Together, Lockie and Remy explore the idea that the personal is political, what it means to be visible within a community, and why representation continues to matter.

From there, they turn their attention to clicker training and operant conditioning, a field that has become surprisingly controversial despite its growing influence on modern horse training.

Rather than debating camps and labels, this episode explores the practical realities of training horses, where different approaches overlap, where they diverge, and what both trainers have learned from their own experiences working with horses and people.

This is a conversation about identity, training, belonging, and the importance of staying curious enough to learn from those whose paths differ from our own.

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Most horse people assume dangerous horses are disobedient horses.

What if the opposite is sometimes true?

In this episode of Horse First, Lockie Phillips explores the hidden risks of teaching horses that they have no options, no voice, and no meaningful way to disagree.

Far from creating safety, the removal of dissent can create horses who suppress communication until they have no choice but to express themselves in larger, riskier, and more dramatic ways.

Through practical examples ranging from trailer loading and catching to veterinary care and everyday handling, Lockie examines the difference between obedience and cooperation, compliance and agreement, and why some of the safest horses in the world are the ones who know how to say "no" without losing the relationship.

This is a conversation about consent, communication, and the often-overlooked connection between freedom and safety.

Because the safest horse isn't the horse who never disagrees.

It's the horse who knows how.

And knows someone is listening

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Together they reflect on the experience of stepping away from everyday life and immersing yourself completely in horses, learning, and community.

The conversation explores the clarity Cat gained around consent, boundaries, safety, technique, and the subtle difference between getting a horse to do something and creating the conditions where a horse genuinely wants to participate.

They also discuss business, teaching, personal growth, and the unexpected ways that living alongside horses and horse people can challenge old assumptions while opening new possibilities.

Most importantly, this episode is about what happens when learning becomes experiential rather than theoretical. When ideas stop living in books, podcasts, and social media posts and start living in your body, your relationships, and your daily practice.

And yes, there was a lot of laughter along the way.

This is a conversation about clarity, growth, and what becomes possible when you give yourself permission to learn deeply.

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